At 03:44 PM 1/16/98 -0800, ANDREW_ATWELLHP-PaloAlto-om20.om.hp wrote:
>        The front brake job is the easy one, it is the rears that need a
>     special VW tool (some have made there own, guys?) but the trick is
>     that the rear caliper pistons need to be turned as they are pushed in
>     (like a screw).

Use a universal brake tool found at most auto parts stores. The one I
bought for $8 is shaped like a cube with different spaced and patterned
knobs on it to fit a variety of caliper pistons that need to be turned back
into the caliper. It fits onto a 3/8" drive wrench. Find the closest set of
knobs that will almost fit the rear caliper piston and file down the
insides of the knobs till the tool fits. Once you have the rear caliper off
and you try to mate the tool to the piston, it should be obvious what you
have to do. Once that's done, rotate the piston in till the top of the
piston is slightly below the edge of its rubber boot. Ask somebody to help
you with this part of the work, as it will be much much easier. If you need
any more help, feel free to email me directly.

Eugene Oh

Here 'ya go.  I happen to have just picked up a set of exactly what you
are looking for.  Mintex Red Box pads, as close to dustless as they come,
with somewhat better performance than the stock pads.
Rear P/N for most, if not all VR6 cars: MDB1377AF
You can order them from New Dimensions 408 980-1691.

-Holland

hjppacbell
phillip3apple

Hi all,

Finally got my host problems solved - missed not being on the list for the past
few days!

Anyway, I just wanted to share my experience with replacing my brake pads (did
the front a few weeks ago, and the rear last night). ...I always like it when
people write about doing a particular maintenance procedure or upgrade that I'm
thinking about doing, so I'll do the same...

A few weeks ago:  I upgraded the front rotors on my '95 GLX to the Velocity
slotted rotors, and Ferodo pads.  I had 62k miles on the stock pads (including
a few autocrosses), and the brake-pad wear indicator FINALLY came on.  Pretty
straightforward installation, following the Bentley's manual, and European
Car's procedure from a long time ago on "Project GLX".

My problems:  Velocity did not have the Ferodo's for the GLX in stock, but they
did have the exact same pads for an Audi.  The only difference:  The plug for
the pad-wear sensor is shaped differently.  I cut the plugs off the new pads,
and soldered on the plugs from the old pads, and everything worked fine.

Second problem:  I read on the list a while back about how easy it is to
mutilate the rotor retaining screw when trying to get it out.  It IS indeed
soft metal.  I followed the advice that I got from the list, and used a
handheld impact driver to get the screws out.  (Of course, I first tried using
a regular screwdriver, and nearly stripped the screw.)  The impact driver
worked great, though.

Third problem:  I wanted to "save" the front rotors, in case I ever needed to
use them again - they weren't in that bad a shape.  But the suckers just would
NOT come off the hub!  (They obviously don't use antiseize at the factory.)
 So, I finally gave in, took the hammer, and WHACKED it all the way around.
  THEN they came off.  Got a lot of dents in the old rotors - guess I'll make a
clock out of them or something.

Installation was a snap.  Used plenty of antiseize between the rotor and hub,
so it won't be so hard to get off next time!

FYI:  I never knew how the brake pad wear sensors work, until I got the old
pads out.  Basically, there's just two wires that go into the pad, and they're
electrically connected with some sort of powder-like substance in the pad.  As
long as this connection is made, the wear-sensor light in the dash stays off.
away, the connection is broken, and the light comes on.  Viola!


Last night:  Installation of rear brake pads.  I wanted to upgrade to the
slotted rear rotors as well, but Velocity's machinist is apparently in the
hospital, and they won't have any rotors for a while! ..Plus, they were out of
the Ferodo's.  They recommended Pagid pads as almost as good, and said on the
rear, it really wouldn't make a difference.  OK, I bought them.  I still
planned to replace the rear wheel bearings, and have the rotors turned, but I
got lazy.  I just replaced the pads, and that's all.  (I figure the bearings
should last through this set of pads, and then I'll replace 'em.  Plus, the
rear rotors looked pretty good - if the new pads wear quicker b/c I didn't have
the rotors turned, the cost will be offset by the fact that I didn't have to
spend more time and money having them turned...)

Problem:  According to Bentley's, when retracting the rear caliper piston, you
have to turn it clockwise as you push it in.  I know there's a tool that'll do
this.  But it's like $60, I think.  According to EC, they used a c-clamp, and
as the clamp turned, it turned the piston.  Great!  So, I planned to use a
brake-pad-piston retractor tool that had a fixed (not floating) end on it,
thinking it would work like a c-clamp.  It didn't.  Once it got tight up
against the piston, it wouldn't go any further, and the piston didn't rotate.
 My (crude) solution:  I tightened up the retractor, then used a pair of
lock-jaw pliers "lightly" clamped around the piston to turn it about half a
turn.  Tighten up the retractor, and turn the piston some more, and so on.  I
noticed that I really didn't even need pressure on the piston - merely rotating
it caused it to retract.  So, it took a lot of care and a few extra minutes,
but it worked!


Results so far:  The car stops, so I'm happy.  I haven't wailed on the brakes
yet, but it stops as well as it did new, and the brakes don't squeek at all.
saying Ferodo's are quite dirty. ...Looking at my rear rotors today, I can tell
(I think) where the high spots and low spots on the rotors are - maybe I
should've had them machined. ...But, I figure in a few days, the pads will have
"fit" themselves to the rotors, and we'll be good to go!

...I didn't flush the brake fluid when I did the pads. ...I replaced it with
Super Blue a year ago, and will do it again next year...  The pedal isn't soft
at all, and I won't be doing any track events until next year anyway!

Sorry for the longwinded message!  Just thought I'd share.

Any questions?

Dave

andersonmsai.mea

Hi Jud -

I'd made my own caliper-retraction tool, and it seemed to work OK.  It's
constructed from a 13mm-head bolt and nut, a large washer, and two 6-32
screws and nuts.  Photo at
http://www.p-vector.com/bob/private/braketool005.jpg .  Use a 13mm deep
socket on the nut, and engage the 6-32 screws in the slots on the
caliper.  Give a hefty push on the ratchet as you crank it clockwise,
and the caliper will retract.

I recall reading somewhere (but don't remember where) that if you
attempt to brute-force the piston back in, you can harm the parking
brake mechanism.

Good luck,
- - Bob T.
  '96 GTI VR6

On Friday, March 17, 2000 8:30:48 AM, Judson Main wrote:

> I don't have a special tool, so I plan to
> just use a regular large C-clamp since
> the clamp parts rotate in a circular
> fashion.  You guys think this will work
> well?

A C-clamp will *NOT* work- every C-clamp I've seen allows the head of the
clamp to spin, and it will not provide the necessary turning force. It does
take a fair bit of effort to turn the piston. I have seen Bob Tillman's
brake retractor, and it seems to have worked pretty well. Using the C-clamp
will likely result in a useless parking brake adjuster mechanism.

> I've put a complete (and I mean, complete)
> Scirocco 16V brake system into an 80
> Scirocco, so I'm sure I can handle this.
> BUT getting those pistons retracted far
> enough I do know can be a bitch, AND I've
> never done the VR6 before, SO...any other
> trip-ups?

The VR6 is virtually identical. (at least in general- details are somewhat
different.)
Chris

I'm afraid to say that mine came off pretty easy. Of course check that the
brake is all the way off and maybe even give it a few yanks to try to pop it
loose. Also try jacking the car up by the suspension (instead of the body)
to cause it to compress and maybe give you some more slack in the cables.
Good luck.
Patrick

aqnpanix wrote:
>Marker510aol wrote:
>> Andy, buy the tool or have the work done.  For about $60 you can have the 
>> correct VW/Audi rear brake tool.
>
>  Dang, if I knew it was *that* reasonably priced I would have gotten
>  one.  I just naturally assumed that being a VW "special tool", it
>  would have been made of unobtainium alloy and would be priced
>  accordingly.

It is BTW, a very nicely built tool.  Black, anodized, milled steel, 
disassembles (probably for different sized heads) and clicks back together 
to fit it into tight spaces and everything turns by easily by hand until it 
has tension on it. Then you simply attach a socket to the end, or use a
box end wrench (which won't fall off) and it turns and retracts the piston 
at the same time.    I just wish it had more uses.   When you
consider that the metal spark plug wire tool is $30 and it's just
a tube with a handle and a slot in it, this brake tool for $60 looks
like a real deal.

Here's some photos.
http://www.houseofthud.com/images/braketoolretracted.jpg
http://www.houseofthud.com/images/braketoolextended.jpg
http://www.houseofthud.com/images/braketoolapart.jpg

Andy, you can have those photos for the library if you want em.

[ In addition to the above location for the pics, I have also snagged the pics and put them here on this Web site:
aqn ]

        ian

HI, I looked though your library section and have found it extremely
helpful.  I've been doing my v-dub brakes using a set of channel-lock
pliers, with thumb pressure to push the piston back into the rear
caliper as I rotate it with the Pliers.  I wanted to suggest this to the
site, as the other writers of tech tips omitted this quick and easy
method.  Definately not worth the $60.00 tool just to do rear brakes
once every 5 yrs.